Setharion
The Chairman
I am the truth, and I walk alone[N4:hitman316#savatage79#savatage79#]
Posts: 2,250
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Post by Setharion on Jun 17, 2011 16:33:08 GMT -5
I love Dragon Age but i think they need to give DA a break and come back to the realm of Baldurs Gate, man i would all over that release in a heartbeat...who else?
For me Baldurs Gate games are just some of the greatest rpgs ever, had a blast when they came out.
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Post by doktorljubavi on Jun 17, 2011 22:34:41 GMT -5
Only problem with that is it wouldn't sell well. Todays market is geared towards facerolling. If there is a hint of difficulty in the game, it gets bad reviews. If there is a hint of any math, or anything that makes the player think, it gets bad reviews.
There is a reason DA2 turned out the way it did, if they were to make a new Baldur's Gate, they'd either have to strip majority of the customization, and difficulty out and piss off fans, or make it how the old BG was, but not make a whole lot of dosh.
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Post by People Is Tasty on Jun 17, 2011 22:43:36 GMT -5
Only problem with that is it wouldn't sell well. Todays market is geared towards facerolling. If there is a hint of difficulty in the game, it gets bad reviews. If there is a hint of any math, or anything that makes the player think, it gets bad reviews. There is a reason DA2 turned out the way it did, if they were to make a new Baldur's Gate, they'd either have to strip majority of the customization, and difficulty out and piss off fans, or make it how the old BG was, but not make a whole lot of dosh. The reason DA2 turned out like it did is that they tried to "gain call of duty's audience" (http://www.nowgamer.com/news/5141/bioware-we-want-call-of-dutys-audience) and streamlined the hell out of the game. With the news E3 and various news sites gave about ME3 as well (lol adding even more of kinect + multiplayer), I'd rather Bioware not make any more Baldur's gates, because I know they'd just butcher them to hell and back. |
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Post by doktorljubavi on Jun 17, 2011 22:55:24 GMT -5
Only problem with that is it wouldn't sell well. Todays market is geared towards facerolling. If there is a hint of difficulty in the game, it gets bad reviews. If there is a hint of any math, or anything that makes the player think, it gets bad reviews. There is a reason DA2 turned out the way it did, if they were to make a new Baldur's Gate, they'd either have to strip majority of the customization, and difficulty out and piss off fans, or make it how the old BG was, but not make a whole lot of dosh. The reason DA2 turned out like it did is that they tried to "gain call of duty's audience" (http://www.nowgamer.com/news/5141/bioware-we-want-call-of-dutys-audience) Right, because cawadooty kids make up more of a % of gamers than us nerds. Bioware went after better sales than loyalty. |
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Setharion
The Chairman
I am the truth, and I walk alone[N4:hitman316#savatage79#savatage79#]
Posts: 2,250
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Post by Setharion on Jun 17, 2011 23:16:02 GMT -5
Thats what i dont get about this day and age, like there is nothing for a pure audience anymore like for instance, ill just give a basic analogy.
Lets say im a musician, i am in a metal band and i put out an album that gets recognition and is given the nod by metal fans as one amazing album. We dont outsell anyone persay but we just put out an album that sells 500,000 copies...and its just one of the most kickass albums ever.
But then come the next album, i look over and see lady gaga selling lets say 3 million albums and i go wow i want a piece of that crowd. And then my next album is metal but its got some pop/electronic vibe too it where i turn off the original people that put me on the map, the original 500k albums i sold, those people are now saying it sucks. But i gained maybe a handful of that lady gaga crowd.
Its like...why do it?
I realize money is the factor, but id imagine entertainment is a business where you do something because you love to entertain in that aspect or that way. And then you go and just change to grab other audiences.
As i write it it just is money, thats it...so i guess that analogy just fails because someone would say "well if they can make more money doing it this way then they will"...and its just ashame that it cant be satisfactory to just have an audience that buys your stuff and loves it for what it is.
So i guess theres no true solution, even if lets say a new game series comes out named like "Dagnors Gate"...and its just a hardcore to the bone rpg, and it is just amazing...the 2nd will follow suit as i said above and become more casual to sell more or gain more audience and thats pretty much it, the pattern i feel will never change.
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Post by People Is Tasty on Jun 18, 2011 2:38:10 GMT -5
Thats what i dont get about this day and age, like there is nothing for a pure audience anymore like for instance, ill just give a basic analogy. Lets say im a musician, i am in a metal band and i put out an album that gets recognition and is given the nod by metal fans as one amazing album. We dont outsell anyone persay but we just put out an album that sells 500,000 copies...and its just one of the most kickass albums ever. But then come the next album, i look over and see lady gaga selling lets say 3 million albums and i go wow i want a piece of that crowd. And then my next album is metal but its got some pop/electronic vibe too it where i turn off the original people that put me on the map, the original 500k albums i sold, those people are now saying it sucks. But i gained maybe a handful of that lady gaga crowd. Its like...why do it? I realize money is the factor, but id imagine entertainment is a business where you do something because you love to entertain in that aspect or that way. And then you go and just change to grab other audiences. As i write it it just is money, thats it...so i guess that analogy just fails because someone would say "well if they can make more money doing it this way then they will"...and its just ashame that it cant be satisfactory to just have an audience that buys your stuff and loves it for what it is. So i guess theres no true solution, even if lets say a new game series comes out named like "Dagnors Gate"...and its just a hardcore to the bone rpg, and it is just amazing...the 2nd will follow suit as i said above and become more casual to sell more or gain more audience and thats pretty much it, the pattern i feel will never change. Honestly, I think that is just on Biowares end. You can do both, CD ProjektRED has proven this. TW/TW2 are examples. TW2 (as a recent example) a fairly complex RPG with a great story, great gameplay, fantastic graphics on amazing engine built specifically for the game sold 150,000 in store hardcopy preorders, which is ridiculous for a PC game in this digital distribution age, that's not even TOUCHING digital preorders on GoG, STEAM, D2D etc. their sales, overall according to them were "really good". In terms of staying loyal to a fan base while maintaining good sales, it can be done. The Witcher 2 was literally just like The Witcher, but with improvements. For comparison: Dragon Age 2's budget: 25 Million, not including advertising, which was supposedly pretty big The Witcher 2's budget: 10 Million, "may" include advertising, cannot confirm Bioware seems to be leaning hard towards shovelware. TL;DR: you can make a great game that stays loyal to your fanbase while still making big profits. Bioware just chose to go only for sales instead of putting in effort for a balance to make a good game, and they suffered for it, DA2 was considered a horrible flop even with paid off reviewers and astroturfing, while TW2 did very well. |
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Post by doktorljubavi on Jun 18, 2011 12:55:49 GMT -5
Witcher 2 was heavily complained about by cawadooty kids because it was "too hard". Saying things like "It wants to be a hack and slash but it's not". There was some walkthrough guy that I think I linked to you before where he whined all the way through, took 3 hours to complete the introduction.
Witcher 2 got a lot of sales because nerdy gamers are a pretty large(not weight wise lol) force. Bioware seems to think there is more sales to be had to try and appeal to the cawadooty demographic.
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teylix
Level 2
[N4:teylix#teylix#teylix#]
Posts: 145
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Post by teylix on Jun 18, 2011 14:24:50 GMT -5
I don't know.. I mean there will always be someone complaining. That's just how it is, but I don't have this superiority complex that the mainstream gamers dont know a good game when it slaps them in the face.
Of course it boggles my mind how a re-hashed CoD/Halo sells ridiculous amounts while Valkyria Chronicles had paltry sales here.
Some people complained because of Demon Souls difficulty and rated it down because of it, but most reviewers actually gave it a plus.
OTOH, I've noticed the "streamlining" aka DDD or dumbing down for downers. The fact DA2 got rid of equipping your party while trying to sell the fact from DA:O that it is an oldschool RPG was just asinine.
I have faith that Bioware would do Baldurs Gate justice in some sort of reboot. People will complain that it isnt "faithful" to the first games but that's because some elements do not age well and should be scrapped for newer ideas.
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